LIST OF ACTIONS REGARDING E51/E52 CATALYTIC CONVERTER ISSUES

[luisgate]

Having 're read this entire thread ( https://forum.elgrandoc.uk/threads/...and-the-do-not-remove-rear-cats-debate.18398/ ) again this morning here are my conclusions and the options available of which there are at least half a dozen. Rough costs are an estimate on people's postings throughout the forum. So please dont abuse me if some are slightly inaccurate!!! No agenda as I don't even own an e51 so completely impartial take on the matter.

Option 1.
Remove/decore the rear cats. Cost £100
Pros- cheap and easy. Van down time = a couple of hours.
Cons- not a 100% safe fix, and could still have future problems from front cats blocking themselves.

Option 2.
Remove/decore the front cats leaving the rears. Cost £400
Pros- eliminates chance of cat break down and blockage. Still a reasonable price.
Cons- more difficult to do, greater difficulty finding someone to carry out the work. Emissions feed back unknown. Van down time = 1 day

Option 3.
Remove/decore both front and rear cats and replace with aftermarket cats down stream. Cost £900
Pros- completely eliminates risk of old cats disintegrating. Healthy emmisions.
Cons- more expensive, very, very slim chance aftermarket cat could disintegrate in future. Van down time = 1 day.

Option 4.
Complete new stainless exhaust system with aftermarket cats. Cost £ 1200-1700
Pros- removes risk of original cat disintegration, sound lovely will last a long time.
Cons- more expensive. Very, very slim chance of cat failure. Van down time = 1 day

Option 5.
Lpg install. With full cat removal. Cost £2000+
Pros- eliminates any possibility of cat failure, cheaper fuel for future use. No emission worries at MOT as tested on lpg not petrol.
Cons- more expensive process, future lpg servicing costs, not all systems/setups are perfect causing possibility of other mechanical issues. Van down time = 3/4 days. Plus delivery/accommodation costs during process.

Option 6.
Carry on as you are with whatever process you've already done or not done.
Pros- live in a world of bliss and worry about what if's later. And enjoy life and your Elgrand.
Cons- your car could (But might not) breakdown at any moment. Expensive repair bill (£2.5k) or scrap value only.

Do with this what you will. The info is out there for anyone to read and make an informed decision on how, why, or what you want to do to extend the life of an Elgrand.
Don't think this discussion will ever go away, so long as people are still buying elgrands and not doing their homework on them.

Very interesting options, very useful thread. I had to arrange a tailored made stainless steel for my E51, costing something about £800 (and I though it was expensive at the time!). That was 5 years ago and still holding, fingers crossed

 

[Johnny88]

E52... Any horror stories ?
I have an 3.5 on lpg and the installer didn't remove cats on this one ....

 

[simon2008]

Having 're read this entire thread ( https://forum.elgrandoc.uk/threads/...and-the-do-not-remove-rear-cats-debate.18398/ ) again this morning here are my conclusions and the options available of which there are at least half a dozen. Rough costs are an estimate on people's postings throughout the forum. So please dont abuse me if some are slightly inaccurate!!! No agenda as I don't even own an e51 so completely impartial take on the matter.

Option 1.
Remove/decore the rear cats. Cost £100
Pros- cheap and easy. Van down time = a couple of hours.
Cons- not a 100% safe fix, and could still have future problems from front cats blocking themselves.

Option 2.
Remove/decore the front cats leaving the rears. Cost £400
Pros- eliminates chance of cat break down and blockage. Still a reasonable price.
Cons- more difficult to do, greater difficulty finding someone to carry out the work. Emissions feed back unknown. Van down time = 1 day

Option 3.
Remove/decore both front and rear cats and replace with aftermarket cats down stream. Cost £900
Pros- completely eliminates risk of old cats disintegrating. Healthy emmisions.
Cons- more expensive, very, very slim chance aftermarket cat could disintegrate in future. Van down time = 1 day.

Option 4.
Complete new stainless exhaust system with aftermarket cats. Cost £ 1200-1700
Pros- removes risk of original cat disintegration, sound lovely will last a long time.
Cons- more expensive. Very, very slim chance of cat failure. Van down time = 1 day

Option 5.
Lpg install. With full cat removal. Cost £2000+
Pros- eliminates any possibility of cat failure, cheaper fuel for future use. No emission worries at MOT as tested on lpg not petrol.
Cons- more expensive process, future lpg servicing costs, not all systems/setups are perfect causing possibility of other mechanical issues. Van down time = 3/4 days. Plus delivery/accommodation costs during process.

Option 6.
Carry on as you are with whatever process you've already done or not done.
Pros- live in a world of bliss and worry about what if's later. And enjoy life and your Elgrand.
Cons- your car could (But might not) breakdown at any moment. Expensive repair bill (£2.5k) or scrap value only.

Do with this what you will. The info is out there for anyone to read and make an informed decision on how, why, or what you want to do to extend the life of an Elgrand.
Don't think this discussion will ever go away, so long as people are still buying elgrands and not doing their homework on them.

Hi great info I just joined in anticipation of getting my Elgrand in a few weeks. I have just paid a deposit for my Elgrand ,I have asked the current owner about his cats and he has no idea owned the vehicle for over 10 years how do you tell if the ceramic is inside the cats or not what signs can you see to tell if the work is already done or not regrading removing the ceramic

 

[Bob Edwards]

i would think after 10 years on English roads the exhaust must be at the end of its life maybe look at changing the whole system for stainless and have no worries for the duration of ownership

 

[alsmoo]

More Brilliant info from the Elgrand OC. Top notch thanks.

 

[camperbaby]

I'm wondering now about this whole cat business. I am about to buy a 2009 E 51 with 42,000 miles grade 4.5 from a company that imports - they do the cat core removal, I believe it's method 1). and the undercoating as well. Am I correct in assuming that deterioration of the ceramics happens not just with age, but with mileage? 42,000 miles it's fairly low for 2009.

 

[LeStempy]

There doesn't seem to be any pattern to it. There are cars on here over 200k km with original cats but others have had cat failure below 100k km. It may be more down to usage and driving style than age or distance. Nissan's answer was to adjust the fueling so they obviously considered that to be part of the problem.

From reading all the accounts of failure here I would suggest a rich mixture or over fuelling could accelerate cat demise, so constant short journeys, poor maintenance, incorrect set up of LPG systems, traffic light drag races or anything else that could dump raw fuel through the cats might cause premature failure.

There is no way to tell how the vehicle has been used by it's Japanese owner. There's also the possibility that it left Japan having been clocked before auction, so the ones that have failed may have more milage than indicated.

So it really is very difficult to predict when or if your cats will fail, the best course of action for peace of mind would be replacing or removing the front cats even if the rears have been removed.

 

[camperbaby]

many thanks that’s super helpful and thoughtful. I’ll have a chat with the dealer as well, they decore when they arrive so I’ll find out who they use - anyone recommend a fitter in East Sussex area?

Short journeys for me would be the issue - not racing or heavy gas pedalling.

 

[jakierobo85]

Having 're read this entire thread ( https://forum.elgrandoc.uk/threads/...and-the-do-not-remove-rear-cats-debate.18398/ ) again this morning here are my conclusions and the options available of which there are at least half a dozen. Rough costs are an estimate on people's postings throughout the forum. So please dont abuse me if some are slightly inaccurate!!! No agenda as I don't even own an e51 so completely impartial take on the matter.

Option 1.
Remove/decore the rear cats. Cost £100
Pros- cheap and easy. Van down time = a couple of hours.
Cons- not a 100% safe fix, and could still have future problems from front cats blocking themselves.

Option 2.
Remove/decore the front cats leaving the rears. Cost £400
Pros- eliminates chance of cat break down and blockage. Still a reasonable price.
Cons- more difficult to do, greater difficulty finding someone to carry out the work. Emissions feed back unknown. Van down time = 1 day

Option 3.
Remove/decore both front and rear cats and replace with aftermarket cats down stream. Cost £900
Pros- completely eliminates risk of old cats disintegrating. Healthy emmisions.
Cons- more expensive, very, very slim chance aftermarket cat could disintegrate in future. Van down time = 1 day.

Option 4.
Complete new stainless exhaust system with aftermarket cats. Cost £ 1200-1700
Pros- removes risk of original cat disintegration, sound lovely will last a long time.
Cons- more expensive. Very, very slim chance of cat failure. Van down time = 1 day

Option 5.
Lpg install. With full cat removal. Cost £2000+
Pros- eliminates any possibility of cat failure, cheaper fuel for future use. No emission worries at MOT as tested on lpg not petrol.
Cons- more expensive process, future lpg servicing costs, not all systems/setups are perfect causing possibility of other mechanical issues. Van down time = 3/4 days. Plus delivery/accommodation costs during process.

Option 6.
Carry on as you are with whatever process you've already done or not done.
Pros- live in a world of bliss and worry about what if's later. And enjoy life and your Elgrand.
Cons- your car could (But might not) breakdown at any moment. Expensive repair bill (£2.5k) or scrap value only.

Do with this what you will. The info is out there for anyone to read and make an informed decision on how, why, or what you want to do to extend the life of an Elgrand.
Don't think this discussion will ever go away, so long as people are still buying elgrands and not doing their homework on them.

Any links to where to buy the full stainless steel exhaust system?

 

[LeStempy]

Find your nearest Powerflo.

 

[Gibbsy]

Advisable

 

[KampingKerry]

Hi there, going to look at an Elgrand tomorrow but they said the rear cats have been removed and since then the engine management light has been on and just needs reset - would this be accurate and not much to worry about or more hassle than it's worth and perhaps a deeper issue?

Also got brakes advisory on MOT but it's done 91k miles so I guess to be expected

 

[LeStempy]

Walk away.

 

[UK-Marine]

Hi there, going to look at an Elgrand tomorrow but they said the rear cats have been removed and since then the engine management light has been on and just needs reset - would this be accurate and not much to worry about or more hassle than it's worth and perhaps a deeper issue?

Also got brakes advisory on MOT but it's done 91k miles so I guess to be expected

I believe the EML doesn’t come on with cat removal….as LeStempy advises best to walk away.

 

[Highway Dave]

This would “ usually “ mean they cannot reset otherwise they would have
@LeStempy is right ( don’t tell him I said that)

 

[JohnK]

Deffo walk away. Rear cat removal wouldn't make eml light come on. If it could be reset they would have done it. Eml light on would be an mot failure.