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Rest Of World Timing chains and sprockets replacement

boolsifter

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In the military I worked on aircraft. Aircraft often remain in service for 50 years or more. The reason, maintenance. Aircraft are continuously renewed, because when something breaks it gets replaced with a new part. The aircraft maintenance plan has worked well for me.
 

Kenzie

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I also am ex military and all our land vehicles had services carried out every 6 months even if th3 vehicle had only been driven from workshop to parking space less than 1km but different strokes for different folks my personal army vehicle was a 1983 lr 110 in 2012 it had 65000k works out about 2000k a year prevention is better than cure
 

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Personally servicing an engine at 6000km or 12000km will not make much difference with the life span of the timing chain.
There have been recalls on some Nissan cars for timing chain/tensioner replacement due to chains stretching (Nissan Navarra d22 for existence) but no recalls for the VQ35DE. My concern with the VQ35DE is oil pressure or lack of it especially in the lower rev range and it's that that can causing timing chain rattle. If you're timing chain rattle on tick over and goes silent when you increase rpm it's the lack of oil pressure.
 

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I replaced all my chains at 148000km...

Then i replaced them again 1 year later with Nissan parts as the garbage ebay ones had stretched. To be fair to me at the time of first replacement getting Nissan ones on the UK was a PITA.

Took me about 15hrs (disassemble/reassemble) first time, less the second.

It's up there with the worst jobs to do on a VQ engine when it's still in the van (IMO). Getting at the rear sprockets requires taking off the valve covers and taking half the engine apart to get the bolts hidden by the cam shaft.

Lesson? Buy cheap, pay twice ; )
 

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Personally servicing an engine at 6000km or 12000km will not make much difference with the life span of the timing chain.
There have been recalls on some Nissan cars for timing chain/tensioner replacement due to chains stretching (Nissan Navarra d22 for existence) but no recalls for the VQ35DE. My concern with the VQ35DE is oil pressure or lack of it especially in the lower rev range and it's that that can causing timing chain rattle. If you're timing chain rattle on tick over and goes silent when you increase rpm it's the lack of oil pressure.
my gasket (the crappy paper one) was pretty much toast when i took off the front cover, so i reckon that contributed to the chain wear. The top two tensioners had deep grooves indicating poor oil lubrication and i had two teeth missing from the drivers side rear sprocket (which i thankfully found in the oil pan).

halfway through rebuild - you can see how much burnt oil is at the top from it geting cooked.

1611833612630.png


...guess it had had a hard life driving around japanese business men :)
 

Lacabrera

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my gasket (the crappy paper one) was pretty much toast when i took off the front cover, so i reckon that contributed to the chain wear. The top two tensioners had deep grooves indicating poor oil lubrication and i had two teeth missing from the drivers side rear sprocket (which i thankfully found in the oil pan).

halfway through rebuild - you can see how much burnt oil is at the top from it geting cooked.

View attachment 48275


...guess it had had a hard life driving around japanese business men :)
I replaced mine back in October. Managed to find a company in Dubai advertising on Ebay selling genuine Nissan parts. I unfortunately had not heard about that troublesome gasket at the time. I'm thinking about connecting a pressure gauge to keep an eye on pressure. Mine was rattling for the first couple seconds on start up after its sat for a few days. There is a gasket on the main tensioner that if it leaks the oil drains from the tensioner over a period couple days. I replaced it and has made a difference. (Being the only tensioner you can do without major surgery.
 

Lacabrera

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my gasket (the crappy paper one) was pretty much toast when i took off the front cover, so i reckon that contributed to the chain wear. The top two tensioners had deep grooves indicating poor oil lubrication and i had two teeth missing from the drivers side rear sprocket (which i thankfully found in the oil pan).

halfway through rebuild - you can see how much burnt oil is at the top from it geting cooked.

View attachment 48275


...guess it had had a hard life driving around japanese business men :)
I'm not convinced that's burnt on oil, mine was the same and I I reckon its blow buy gases from combustion that's built up over time. Possibly from a faulty PCV.
 

Pixelpoker

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I'm not convinced that's burnt on oil, mine was the same and I I reckon its blow buy gases from combustion that's built up over time. Possibly from a faulty PCV.
Yes - could be. I replaced various bits when doing the chain - most of the hoses at the rear of the engine were rock hard and split.

I've been looking at options for an oli pressure gauge - i'm old skool so like an actual gauge, not a digital one...
 

Lacabrera

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Yes - could be. I replaced various bits when doing the chain - most of the hoses at the rear of the engine were rock hard and split.

I've been looking at options for an oli pressure gauge - i'm old skool so like an actual gauge, not a digital one...
I'm old school too and would prefer a mechanical gauge. I installed one on a previous truck and found a plug on the main oil gallery to install too, but not sure on this one yet. Let us know if you have any ideas on the connection. I did read a similar topic on a 350z forum connecting a digital gauge to the existing pressure switch but it went off topic with no out come.
 

djaolnes2

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Interesting problems with your commodore.. wheel bearings screaming? You would think that in Australia these sort of temps would not be a problem. The hubs on these are a sealed bearing, and pretty much the same since VR, so you would think that they would have seen these problems and sorted them. In my experience I never saw a problem with these bearings, but I guess it can happen. Over 40 degrees is hot, but I am sure the bearings see hotter temps than this in normal operation.
Similarly a power steering pump cavitating? Sounds extreme.
Good to read about the history of timing chains around this era. I didn't expect that and had assumed that it was just a problem with the alloytec.
I had a VZ wagon, LS1 engine though, and it was fine.
Was the Holden replacement chain and sprocket setup smaller chains and more sprocket teeth?
 

boolsifter

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Interesting problems with your commodore.. wheel bearings screaming? You would think that in Australia these sort of temps would not be a problem. The hubs on these are a sealed bearing, and pretty much the same since VR, so you would think that they would have seen these problems and sorted them. In my experience I never saw a problem with these bearings, but I guess it can happen. Over 40 degrees is hot, but I am sure the bearings see hotter temps than this in normal operation.
Similarly a power steering pump cavitating? Sounds extreme.
Good to read about the history of timing chains around this era. I didn't expect that and had assumed that it was just a problem with the alloytec.
I had a VZ wagon, LS1 engine though, and it was fine.
Was the Holden replacement chain and sprocket setup smaller chains and more sprocket teeth?
To clarify, the screaming front bearings, cavitating power steering pump, electronics failures, all occured on my Nissan NE51 Elgrand. The Commodore was before the Elgrand, and the Alloytec engine was trashed. The person who bought it with full disclosure from me of the Alloytec engine problem, was a used car dealer, and he pulled the Alloytec, and put a Ecotec 3.8 V6 from a pre-double overhead cam Commodore.
My connections at GM (I retired from there) advised not to try and fix the Alloytec. Double the number of sprocket teeth and double the number of links in the timing chain were not the only changes to the VE (next generation). The changes included more oil ports, better chain lubrication, spraying oil on the top of the chains, and oil cooler to use the oil as a heat transfer media. The VZ tenure was August 2004 – July 2006 (sedan) August 2004 – August 2007 (wagon, utility), and VE series began. The VE sedan rollout was VE in July 2006 and UTE and wagon in August 2007.

I got the Elgrand after the Commodore. I got the 2019 Isuzu d'max when we purchased a 24.5 foot caravan, handicap equipped, with dhollandia wheelchair lift, handicap bathroom, and asiles large enough for a wheelchair. The Elgrand was not qualified to tow the caravan, so the d'max resulted. Unfortunately the d'max has no handicap lift, like my Elgrand, so I have to make one. Phil
 

djaolnes2

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I looked for VQ35de timing chain problems, and it seems to be more problems with the tensioners and the guides breaking, and not timing chains stretching. This is different to the Alloytec problems which were clearly problems with the chains stretching.
The information online suggests that the Alloytec chains were not built to design spec from the beginning, and they released a fix for this.
 

boolsifter

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I looked for VQ35de timing chain problems, and it seems to be more problems with the tensioners and the guides breaking, and not timing chains stretching. This is different to the Alloytec problems which were clearly problems with the chains stretching.
The information online suggests that the Alloytec chains were not built to design spec from the beginning, and they released a fix for this.
According to the engine guys the fix didn't work long term. More was needed, that is why they said don't bother trying to fix the Alloytec. Still the tensioner failures were heat related, then subsequently chain stretching. I had a look and the sprockets were nearly gone. The chain links were worn quite visibly. Phil
 

djaolnes2

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Oh okay. I thought you were talking about problems with the Commodore.
My experience with Elgrands has been good so far. I drove across the Nularbor a year and a bit ago in summer and it ran perfectly.
I think that there might be a real problem with some of these as being higher Kms than the odometer shows, which might show up in various faults. The 2wd one I have is at just over 100k kms and doing well.

Interesting that a car dealer would replace an alloytec with a ecotec. I think they would be a better engine, and far more reliable, but I thought there would be a problem installing an older engine in the newer model. Still, if they have done it they would have known what they were doing.

Good luck with making your handicap lift, if I read your problem correctly. FWIW the Elgrand one I have seems to be pretty simple and may be possible to retrofit them. The Elgrand does have a lot of clearance with the sliding doors, so maybe a regular door would present a problem?
It does have interlocks with the rest of the van though, so I am not sure how integrated it is with the rest of the electronics. I do know I had to bridge a wire to tell the car that the seat was un-deployed when I removed it from the van, but I am not sure of everything else. There is a remote, but I am not sure if it talks directly with the seat of the van.

The welcab seat mounts to a bracket/base, which then bolts in to replace where the factory runners are for the 2nd row passenger side seat. From memory the connector has power for the seat, plus a few wires for signalling.
 
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boolsifter

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Oh okay. I thought you were talking about problems with the Commodore.
My experience with Elgrands has been good so far. I drove across the Nularbor a year and a bit ago in summer and it ran perfectly.
I think that there might be a real problem with some of these as being higher Kms than the odometer shows, which might show up in various faults. The 2wd one I have is at just over 100k kms and doing well.

Interesting that a car dealer would replace an alloytec with a ecotec. I think they would be a better engine, and far more reliable, but I thought there would be a problem installing an older engine in the newer model. Still, if they have done it they would have known what they were doing.

Good luck with making your handicap lift, if I read your problem correctly. FWIW the Elgrand one I have seems to be pretty simple and may be possible to retrofit them. It does have interlocks with the rest of the van though, so I am not sure how integrated it is with the rest of the electronics. I do know I had to bridge a wire to tell the car that the seat was un-deployed when I removed it from the van, but I am not sure of everything else. There is a remote, but I am not sure if it talks directly with the seat of the van.
Not a problem. I have a friend with a 2006 wagon who put a Ecotec 3.8 in and no more problems. Eventually the friend bought a Toyota Prado after retiring from follow me work, going with the big rigs to mining locations. The Commodore wagon had extremely high kilometers most after the 3.8 Ecotec..
 

boolsifter

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When the engine runs poorly, and you hear the timing chains rattling, there is something happening that you can't see or hear. The tensioner has run out of travel. When it hits the stop, the chain begins to get a lot hotter, accelerating the heat stretch. It is what you can't see or hear that hurts you.

I worked on aircraft maintenance in the Air Force, and yes you can defer maintenance. Of course, some of your planes will fall out of the sky if you defer maintenance too long. Some have this happen to their automobiles, giving the salvage dissasemblers jobs. So that works out OK, if you are a disassembler.
 

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Hello from Queensland,
Looks like I'm up for the timing chain and sprockets replacement. I have about 150,000 kilometers, so it appears I am overdue as service says 100,000 kilometers.

For the moment we are using our 2019 Isuzu d'max X Rider, but it has no handicap lift, so I am lifting our 30 year old daughter with MS and a host of other issues, into the right rear of the d'max, oh my aching 71 year old back.
XL seat from Startracks USA
I have been trying to buy one of these, but with the COVID19 lockdown, having trouble getting in touch with the supplier in Elkhart, Indiana USA. Shipping is also a nightmare. Phil
I hope I dont need to do this
 

Pixelpoker

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word to the wise - if you spend that much time digging into the guts of the engine only use Nissan parts, not evil bay stuff.....ask me how i know ; )
 

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what's was the fuel consumption before servicing the chain?
 

Richard Fox

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what's was the fuel consumption before servicing the chain?

Mine used more fuel than my other Elgrand and now I am currently replacing the timing chain due to a broken secondary timing chain tensioner.
 
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