• Welcome to the ElgrandOC forum.

    You will find that the majority of the forum is locked, but do not worry. You can unlock more content by registering to the forum completely free. Sign up is automatic, does not require email confirmation and is instant. Feel free to browse through the sections to see what topics have been covered before you register.
    You can register for an account by CLICKING HERE

    Once you have registered, you will unlock more of the forum content. You will not unlock all of the content until you have reached 10 posts. This is to give you an opportunity to chat to existing members and help to integrate you into the forum community.
    We are a friendly and helpful community and there is a wealth of infomation contained within the forum. Please feel free to register, introduce yourself and get to know your fellow members.

    Feel free to look at the Frequently Asked Questions section, the Meets/Events section and the Competition Section without having to register.
    We look forward to getting to know you and help you with any questions or problemd you have with your Elgrand.

E51 The E51 Catalytic Converter Problem

GingeKnievil said:
Gotcha. I was having a chat with my mechanic on Friday. We discussed the cat issue (which I’m still yet to sort). He mentioned the MOT failure, but then I guess he would if he did the job and then MOT’d it next year. His verdict was to leave things as they are because the van is driving as sweet as a nut and that I’d get warning signs should one of the cats go. I’m not saying he’s right and I’m heeding all the opinions in this thread.
Click to expand...
Don't play Russian roulette bud,by the time you get a' warning'it'll probably be too late.👍
 
stevemen said:
For £80 he's no doubt doing half a job mate.
Needs to check condition of front cats also. If deteriorated needs to remove or replace them (if removing them need rear cats left in , but must be unblocked and clear). Also need to removed debris from rest of exhaust.
I've mentioned it a number of times floating lumps of broken cat in the exhaust can cause swirling and the dust gets drawn back in the swirl gradually wearing away at the engine.
Best getting it done right that take the risk. We've had to replace quite a few engines that have suffered with this problem even with back cats removed.
Steve Tojomotorsuk
Click to expand...

Thank you for the advice, Steve. Best I get onto things ASAP.
 
I've got a couple of questions for the boys that know about these things.
Can you help out there?
1. Normal life of a cat is 100k or so.
Is that true for the Elgrand too?
I'm thinking Jap quality v closer install proximity to the manifold.
2. Is the front cat honeycomb the same size/design as the rear cat?
Any experience?
 
I wouldn't say there is a 'normal life'. Not relevant, people in the club have had issue at less than that.

The experience we have is that the fronts can break down, block the rears and kill the engine. That's why pretty much everyone around here recommends getting the rears decored.
 
Snoo said:
I wouldn't say there is a 'normal life'. Not relevant, people in the club have had issue at less than that.

The experience we have is that the fronts can break down, block the rears and kill the engine. That's why pretty much everyone around here recommends getting the rears decored.
Click to expand...
Understand.
Decored mine as the first job 2 years ago.
But I'm now wondering if the fact that the rears have been dealt with by most people is giving a feel good factor but is hiding the fact that the front cats are still a consumable and that this is being overlooked by everyone?
Any evidence from replaced front cats out there?
Photos of damage/mileage?
Maybe with evidence we can build up a picture of expected lifetime to failure.
Also - obviously front face of front cats will be first to breakdown.
When this happens the big bits can't go through the honeycomb so will stay in front of the front cat (this is the danger).
Any dust/small particles will exit through the honeycomb of the first cat then through the decored rear.
Happy days.
So I'm seeing the problem of engine failure caused by front cat failure is still very possible even with decored rears.
All of a sudden a front de-core is looking attractive.
 
Problem is there isn’t a true mileage or age expectation, if the engine runs rich at any point it will affect the cats and cause failure. In theory manufacturers say they last a lifetime but who knows what that means and we know that they don’t on any car.
 
Steve Thompson said:
Understand.
Decored mine as the first job 2 years ago.
But I'm now wondering if the fact that the rears have been dealt with by most people is giving a feel good factor but is hiding the fact that the front cats are still a consumable and that this is being overlooked by everyone?
Any evidence from replaced front cats out there?
Photos of damage/mileage?
Maybe with evidence we can build up a picture of expected lifetime to failure.
Also - obviously front face of front cats will be first to breakdown.
When this happens the big bits can't go through the honeycomb so will stay in front of the front cat (this is the danger).
Any dust/small particles will exit through the honeycomb of the first cat then through the decored rear.
Happy days.
So I'm seeing the problem of engine failure caused by front cat failure is still very possible even with decored rears.
All of a sudden a front de-core is looking attractive.
Click to expand...
This is what has always worried me. I did eventually get the rear cats done though, only took me 3 years to make the decision.

With hindsight, LPG conversion and remove all 4 would have been my preferred option. Who knows how long that loophole will last for though? Won't be long before any kind of modifications are illegal...
 
Just about to purchase an Elgrand Highway Star 2005, so do I decore or remove rear cats.
 
I had rear cats removed and replaced with straight through pipes by a local Mot garage / exhaust specialist who initially wasn't interested as he said it would be an mot failure but after getting the bus up on his ramp to have a look he was happy to do the work. Passed the mot later that month no probs
 
All good info, much appreciated
 
Hi Guys,

I just got rid of my E51 Rider and got myself a E52 2010, Does anybody know if this cat issue affects the E52 aswell? I havent had a look underneath yet to see if it has the quad cats but assuming it does, is this a problem too? I had it removed on my E51.

Also anyone know where therre is a specialist garage who does undersealing in the south east? Cheers
 
Any car with quad cats would have the same problem, so if the E52 does then it would be best to de-core like your E51.
How do you like the E52 in comparison?
 
Thank you for your reply.

when i have time i will check and see if it has the quad cats, im pretty sure it has!!

I loved the E51, It has better seating arrangments more space more sporty looking ( Rider) but there were a few reasons why it had to go! but to answer your question directly, the E52 is simply more refined!

I brought the E51 to use on many roadtrips that we do throughout the year with the family and friends and it was the most practical car that i have owned. The only issue I had was when it wasnt used for roadtrips we used it as the family car, as I recently sold our family car and brought a mid life crisis sports car lol!!

To use the E51 every other day was just too big and old, it felt to much like a van and it would rattle over every crevice on the road. I could of saved the money and spent it on fixing the E51 but ultimatly despite what others think of the E52, the practicality of it combined with the more lux interior (the middle row seating is simply the best ive seen) won me over and I also liked the look of it too! suprisingly!

I found a low mileage with all mileage certs, fully loaded- twin roofs , twin electric doors, front fridge, roof screen, bose system, and importantly 4wd for our ski trips! Cant wait to take it on the next trip! The CVT gearbox isnt that bad, I feel that I need to drive it differently than the 51, more gracefully like a chauffuer, hopefully it will be reliable when its fully loaded.
 
Travellingman said:
Blatantly obvious , If I do it its fine , If someone else does it its questionable , If the Law says it its Optional , If a Mate says it its Gospel Truth , If the Wife says it its Mandatory , If a non driver says it its Crap , Facts discussed in a Pub are much more Scientifically Correct than any Info from Stephen Hawking or that Einstein guy , If an Insurer says the answer is Modified then maybe you shouldnt have asked the Question in the First place ?
plead ignorance and just say it was Foreign so you thought it was a "standard fitting "
Click to expand...
Exactly I wouldn’t know what was after market coming from Japan. If it came over like that I’ll plead ignorance. I didn’t realise the decat was something to disclose or that it could fail an MOT ! I thought it was something that needed doing to conform to Uk rules ! I obviously don’t know much about cars 😳
 
@KeenRyder, glad you are pleased with the E52, I've not seen one yet but sounds lovely. Gearbox sounds OK then, on paper that's the part I would be doubtful about but then its a modern car so its unlike to be bad like early ones. Keep with chauffeur mode and save the speedier driving for your sports car :)
 
a quick question regarding the cats.. I maybe being a bit thick but to my mind if its the front cats that disintegrate and cause the problems is there any reason why the the front cats aren't decoded or removed instead of the rears? Im new to this so please bear with me.
 
AndyB said:
a quick question regarding the cats.. I maybe being a bit thick but to my mind if its the front cats that disintegrate and cause the problems is there any reason why the the front cats aren't decoded or removed instead of the rears? Im new to this so please bear with me.
Click to expand...
yes, the reason is ease of access and the fact rear cats are only there to help emissions on cold start up.

Rear cats can be removed and replaced in 40mins, front cats may need sub frame dropping at cost of several hundred, if you can find someone local to do it.
 
Even though I didn’t pose the question that’s a really informative answer. Thanks for enlightening me too!
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top