E50 OBD Scanning for the 16 pin E50 and E51 Sorted.

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Spannerdemon

Guest
#1
For some time now, I have been wanting to explore the world of OBD codes, and I decided today, that its about time I enlarged my knowledge base. Hopefully this post will be of interest to, and help others. I have a code reader, but despite all the claims, it doesn't pick up the codes on the Elgrand.

This will be to address reading the 16 PIN GREY(looks white to me) PLUG ON MORE RECENT CARS. and hopefully come up with a solution that is economical to us as owners.

i wonder if someone can take a look at the plug wiring in the car, and tell me where I can possibly be going wrong, or if I simply need a different reader.
If I can get this up and running, I can offer to help other members in the South West who might have problems in the future. I'm very mechanically minded, but on this subject will you please accept that my knowledge of this particular area of auto-electrickery is very very limited.

I have the (presumably) standard 16 pin OBD plug under the dash. Diagrams and photos show the wiring.

When I plug in and start the scan, it shows C.A.N. OBD2. Then it scrolls through KWP2000, ISO9141 Protocol and then....LINK ERROR.
It does this every time, so I can only presume that there is no communication between the reader, and the socket.

Can any of you guys who understand this stuff sort me out with it.

Thanks. Keith.














 
#2
Re: OBD Code Reading for the later E50

I may be wrong here but I'm sure the elgrand uses JOBD11 as in a japenses version so a standard OBD2 reader won't work on them. There is software out there that works but think it has to be specific for jap version OBD. Not sure if I can link on here so if not do apologise if not allowed but I'm sure you'd prob find something that will work from <!-- m --><a class="postlink" href="http://www.obd2tuning.com/advanced_search_result.html?search_in_description=1&keyword=JOBD">http://www.obd2tuning.com/advanced_sear ... yword=JOBD</a><!-- m -->
 
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Spannerdemon

Guest
#3
Re: OBD Code Reading for the later E50

Thanks for this Chris. I need to be absolutely sure that what I buy, if I have to get another reader, will work. This seems to be a US site, so not sure about what's on sale.

But thanks for the info, which I'll look at along with other info that, hopefully, others will give me.

This reader I have does read ok, as I have used it without problem on other vehicles.

Keith
 
#4
Re: OBD Code Reading for the later E50

I only linked this site as I always use them myself for code readers but I'm sure there's prob some on eBay and like in the uk.
 
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Spannerdemon

Guest
#5
Re: OBD Code Reading for the later E50

Thanks for this Chris. I am looking at a number of other readers. All of them, including the one I already have SAY that they will read (and I quote) :

"All 1996 and newer OBD 11 compliant vehicles, cars and light trucks sold in the UK, USA, and all Asian and European vehicles.

Well the Elgrand is Asian....... but my reader won't have anything to do with it.

Why.. Is what I want to find out. I don't want to go and spend money on something that also doesn't do the job.

Obviously this 16 pin plug, WHICH according to all the info, SHOULD be able to be read with my own scanner, can't do the business.... But WHY. It says it should. Is it wired wrongly on the vehicle maybe?

I can see this as an issue for many other members, so need to find some answers. What use is this modern 16 pin all singing and dancing diagnostic plug, if it can't be read easily.

Thanks again..... The search goes on.
 

pimpItUp

Active Member
E50 Owner
#6
Re: OBD Code Reading for the later E50

Check if your scanner documentation mentions NISSAN CONSULT-II. As I understand it the later E50s/VQ35DE are a kind of hybrid running the newer OBD2 plug but the Japan flavour CONSULT-II protocol (older had 14 pin plug and Consult-1 and newer E51 true OBD2?). I use a cheap reader I purchased on ebay from China... N607 NISSAN/INFINITI ("MemoScan"?) and it works fine.
 
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Spannerdemon

Guest
#7
Re: OBD Code Reading for the later E50

Thanks Darren.

I was on this until late, late last night.

Basically it seems that despite all the claims by these manufacturers, all I can get back from them is that "Well, they SHOULD work".

My own scanner documentation doesn't mention Nissan Consult II. It's only a cheapie Ebay scanner, but I've read several cars with it....... But not this one!! :|

I'm waiting on an email back from Autel USA who claim to have machines that work, but I am not convinced that they will do this car.
Obviously I've heard of Nissan Consult 1 and 2, but my car was built in 2001. Now, some 14 years on, surely there must be readers that work with the Elgrand. It's just another Nissan after all.

Does anyone know if Nissan are still manufacturing in the UK. I might approach their technical people.

Thanks for the info mate. It's a start at least.

Keith.
 

Rapperfrapper

Here for life
E50 Owner
Premium Member
E50 Expert
#8
Re: OBD Code Reading for the later E50

E50 1997- 2000 will have a 14 pin socket which will need a reader that will communicate with consult 1 software, this is Japan only based software. (ECUTalk or Nissan data scan 1)
E50 2000-2002 have a 16 pin obd socket (same as European obd2 software socket) but you will need a reader that can communicate with consult 2 software. ( Nissan data scan 2)
Im not too familiar with E51 but believe they have the 16 pin obd socket and may still run on consult 2 software, I will have a look once I get my hands on one.
Obd2 plugs are fitted on European cars as they have to confirm to European legislation and all use the same obd2/3/4 software, but as Japan aren't in Europe they don't have to conform , so although they fitted obd sockets they do not run obd2/3/4 software.
Hope this sheds a little light.
I personally use an ECUTalk USB lead and software via a laptop on my E50 1999 without any issues and this software can read and clear codes, plus data log.
I have also run Nissan data scan lite 1 on my android smartphone via an OTG lead connect to the ECUTalk USB lead and again this will read/clear codes, but doesn't data log.
 

Rapperfrapper

Here for life
E50 Owner
Premium Member
E50 Expert
#9
Re: OBD Code Reading for the later E50

If you contact a member on here, called "267" he can probably help a lot more than I can.
 
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Spannerdemon

Guest
#10
Re: OBD Code Reading for the later E50

Thanks for this Rapper. That's a BIG help. I might invest in an ECU talk USB lead, and see how that goes. I've got Android, Windows, Wi - Fi and Bluetooth capability, but I don't have any Apple ioS stuff at all.

Have also been looking for a Bluetooth direct socket link too using Android software.

Also suggested is JOBD II. Not sure if this will work. Any ideas on that? I'm happy to buy something that works..... THAT WORKS being the point. Don't want to throw money away.

Sometimes wish I was back in Hong Kong. There was a gadget and software warehouse near me where I could have probably have picked up exactly what I am now after. There were guys in there, young graduates who would have even made something in a couple of days.

I DON'T have any problems with the car. I just want to be able to read my codes if and when I do, and be able to give help to other owners in the South West area if I can. Just being prepared really.

Thanks mate.

Keith.
 
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vladiemier

Guest
#11
Re: OBD Code Reading for the later E50

The later E50's changed the socket to an OBD2 socket and uses Consult2 software to read it, this link has more info on the subject

<!-- m --><a class="postlink" href="http://www.nissandatascan.com/">http://www.nissandatascan.com/</a><!-- m -->
 

jonesy

Well-Known Member
E51 Owner
#12
Re: OBD Code Reading for the later E50

Keith

This is a great idea. I'm with you on knowing very little about the software/hardware required, but keen to learn and would love to get a reader that works, for if/when something happens....and to avoid the cost of having to take it somewhere to get codes read and cleared.

Hope you find a solution

Nick
 
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Spannerdemon

Guest
#13
Re: OBD Code Reading for the later E50

Thanks Ray and Nick. All this information is brilliant.

I'm not doing this for personal satisfaction. It's just that there are a lot of us with 1999 onward E50 Elgrands, and these don't have the 14 pin socket. As with the photos I have put up, ours have a 16 pin white OBD II Socket under the steering column that certainly can NOT be read by any normal OBD II reader. I don't know what the E51 uses...... But it may help you guys too.

So what I'm trying to do is get as much info as possible, and then get some solid answers from some of the scanner manufacturers who CLAIM to have equipment that works....... But annoyingly, doesn't. That's not good marketing, it's not helpful at all.

Basically I want to find a reader that will identify problems, with their codes, and reset lights where possible. Even if it is just software, via a cable, Bluetooth or WiFi link, something will be better than nothing. Why the Elgrand is so difficult to find a reader for, escapes me...... Its just another Nissan. :confused:

Anyway..... I'm on it, so will update as appropriate.

Can we work on this as a group to try and come up with a solution that will benefit us all.

Keith
 

jonesy

Well-Known Member
E51 Owner
#14
Re: OBD Code Reading for the later E50

Nissan Datascan only lists the E50 (VQ30DE).
There's no mention of the E51 at all.

Just found this, which seems to be referencing the same issues as you Keith, but no solution sadly.
<!-- m --><a class="postlink" href="https://www.scantool.net/forum/index.php?topic=10292.0">https://www.scantool.net/forum/index.php?topic=10292.0</a><!-- m -->

Also found this - may be worth checking (although having googles baud rates, I suspect it's irrelevant with a cable, its more about wireless data speeds)
<!-- m --><a class="postlink" href="http://www.justanswer.com/uk-car/85vw8-nissan-elgrand-hello-own-nissan-elgrand-e51-tried.html">http://www.justanswer.com/uk-car/85vw8- ... tried.html</a><!-- m -->

This claims to cover the Elgrand (all models) but it's £450, However, the spec may be worth checking to see if a cheaper version exists.
<!-- m --><a class="postlink" href="http://www.diagnostic-world.com/pages/professional_diagnostic_kits_194359-z=583570&p=97462.cfm#content_item_97462">http://www.diagnostic-world.com/pages/p ... item_97462</a><!-- m -->


I'll keep looking

Nick
 

jonesy

Well-Known Member
E51 Owner
#15
Re: OBD Code Reading for the later E50

Just found this too

<!-- m --><a class="postlink" href="http://www.justanswer.com/uk-car/7k2p9-e50-hi-greg-i-2001-litre-neo-engined-nissan-elgrand.html">http://www.justanswer.com/uk-car/7k2p9- ... grand.html</a><!-- m -->

It suggests you need a Launch X431 or the Maxidas DS 708 to get into this system from Japan, its not on the same system as UK or US.
Needs a power source from the car battery to the scan tool ,protocol is not the same as the OBD II. where the pin 16 has power .
 
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Simon

Guest
#16
Re: OBD Code Reading for the later E50

Spannerdemon said:
"All 1996 and newer OBD 11 compliant vehicles, cars and light trucks sold in the UK, USA, and all Asian and European vehicles.

Well the Elgrand is Asian....... but my reader won't have anything to do with it.

Why.. Is what I want to find out. I don't want to go and spend money on something that also doesn't do the job.

Obviously this 16 pin plug, WHICH according to all the info, SHOULD be able to be read with my own scanner, can't do the business.... But WHY
To answer your WHY, its because the ECU is NOT OBD II compliant, not other reason, that is THE reason.

Spannerdemon said:
Thanks Ray and Nick. All this information is brilliant.

I'm not doing this for personal satisfaction. It's just that there are a lot of us with 1999 onward E50 Elgrands, and these don't have the 14 pin socket. As with the photos I have put up, ours have a 16 pin white OBD II Socket under the steering column that certainly can NOT be read by any normal OBD II reader. I don't know what the E51 uses...... But it may help you guys too.

So what I'm trying to do is get as much info as possible, and then get some solid answers from some of the scanner manufacturers who CLAIM to have equipment that works....... But annoyingly, doesn't. That's not good marketing, it's not helpful at all.

Basically I want to find a reader that will identify problems, with their codes, and reset lights where possible. Even if it is just software, via a cable, Bluetooth or WiFi link, something will be better than nothing. Why the Elgrand is so difficult to find a reader for, escapes me...... Its just another Nissan. :confused:

Anyway..... I'm on it, so will update as appropriate.

Can we work on this as a group to try and come up with a solution that will benefit us all.

Keith
There is nothing to 'get on' and find out, these threads seems to be going round in circles, its pretty straight forward.

Nissan uses a custom protocol (computer language) to communicate with the ECU called Consult, this is not Elgrand specific and is the same for all Nissans of the same era, some of you must have owned Skylines etc...

Calling the 16pin socket an OBD II socket is technically wrong and causes confusion but alas that's what its called, OBD II is another protocol, you may as well talk French to your Nissan ECU as it understands French as much as it does OBD II, you need to talk to it in Consult.

You NEED a reader that can communicate the Consult protocol, the 16 pin uses Consult II to be specific and the 16 pin DOES provide power. I think the 14 pin uses Consult I but someone else can confirm, I don't know for sure as I have a 16 pin version.

The most common option is Nissan Datascan as per the link vladiemier posted but a few other options are out there, none will give the detail that Datascan does though, ECUTalk is another popular one. I have been happily reading the ECU in my 2000 E50 16pin for a few months via a Bluetooth dongle and an Android app. A reader marked up as OBD II (only) will not work, don't bother contacting manufacturers as they don't know, OBD II covers the majority of cars so they will just assume it works for all. Just get the right tool for the job and it will work fine, there is no mystery!
 
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Spannerdemon

Guest
#17
Re: OBD Code Reading for the later E50

Thanks for this Simon. I think, in fairness, if the manufacturers of the vast majority of these scan tools didn't claim that their scanners/readers DO read Asian vehicles, a lot of confusion would be avoided. Basically they are marketing scanners which do NOT read Asian vehicles at all..... Which is a bit naughty, as they take our money on a false promise.

If there were code readers out there, at a reasonable cost, that actually did what they say they do,
then guys like us will, I am sure, buy them.

The information that you and others have given is great. I said, right at the beginning of this thread, that I know absolutely nothing about this code scanning stuff, so it isn't as easy for me, and probably others to understand as you might think. Please go easy on me, because this whole subject is difficult to understand despite what you might think.

For example, you say
.[glow=blue]I have been happily reading the ECU in my 2000 E50 16pin for a few months via a Bluetooth dongle and an Android app.[/glow]

What dongle............. What App? THAT is exactly the sort of information that's helpful, but what is the actual hardware and software? This is what will crack the problem........ Please tell us.

So, in a nutshell
What should we buy?
Where do we get it from?
How much will it cost?
Is there a 16 pin data link that will communicate with the socket on the car via Bluetooth or Wifi AND android software? .
What software and where can we get it?

Believe me, Simon, if I could just go and buy a scanner, I wouldn't be here. But having seen the cost of genuine Consult II stuff, I'd have to be running a business to make it worthwhile.

Just want to find the stuff to do the job.

I have sent 2 emails to Autel. To their EU HQ, and to their Head Office in China. THEY claim to have reasonably priced scanners that do the job. I await their replies with interest, because I don't think they do.

But if you can save us all time, and tell us WHERE we can get this stuff.............. I'd be very grateful, and probably not be going grey quite as fast.

Like I say. This is probably bread and butter stuff to you. It's not.... Definitely not, to me.

Look forward to your suggestions or solutions. And Thanks in advance. :)

Keith
 

jonesy

Well-Known Member
E51 Owner
#18
Re: OBD Code Reading for the later E50

Agree wirh Keith on all points!

And if we can post a sticky with which reader/software to buy for E50 and E51 model, that would be a huge help to all of us.

Thanks
Nick
 
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Spannerdemon

Guest
#19
Re: OBD Code Reading for the later E50

Just a quickie.

I have just heard back from Autel in Dusseldorf. They are investigating this, now knowing that the communication is via Nissan Consult II protocol. Their tech team will look at it.
 
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Simon

Guest
#20
Re: OBD Code Reading for the later E50

There are many more manufacturers of Asian vehicles than Nissan, the readers may well work for other Asian cars, but not Nissan, so the branding/claims of the tools out there are not incorrect.

Not meaning to be offensive but these tools are designed for people with knowledge of the subject and those people know what they are buying. The tools are correctly marketed but you don't have the knowledge to understand the fine print that explains what protocols are supported, they aren't really targeted at joe blogs off the street to buy.

Consult readers do tend to be vastly more expensive as its a limited market, the OBD II protocol is much more widely used so scanners can be knocked out dirt cheap.

In answer to your question:

Dongle: <!-- m --><a class="postlink" href="http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/ELM327-ODB2-ODB-II-Wireless-Bluetooth-Car-Auto-Diagnostic-Scan-Tool-Scanner-TS-/381222668574?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_3&hash=item58c2a4491e">http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/ELM327-ODB2-O ... 58c2a4491e</a><!-- m -->

App: <!-- m --><a class="postlink" href="https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.nissandatascan.ndsiilite&hl=en_GB">https://play.google.com/store/apps/deta ... e&hl=en_GB</a><!-- m -->